members not progressing...

[JRM]

A friend of mine recently asked me this question regarding their band players. Week after week, a few players show up not knowing the tunes, some with instruments in disarray, generally not progressing.

How do you stop this pattern; change it, without dumping/ discouraging players and seeming to be a tyrant? I passed on a few motivational methods that I know of, but was wondering what sort of techniques work for other pipe-majors, psychologists and teachers out there in bagpipe-land. Now we're definitely not talking about Grade 1 bands here so keep that in mind. :wave:

[tallbagpiper]

Why hesitate to at least warn them? If you're not careful, the other players will become frustrated and wind up with another band. If they show up unprepared, who's going to miss them?

I think we tend to spend too much time trying to take care of those who probably don't give a damn, and not enought tending to those who are serious about our little affliction with the GHB.

[Victoria Crowe]

Originally posted by tallbagpiper:
I think we tend to spend too much time trying to take care of those who probably don't give a damn, and not enought tending to those who are serious about our little affliction with the GHB.I'm not in a band situation, but I couldn't agree with you more at least from a teaching perspective. When I taught art in University, I spent a ton of time with the kids who had potential, but didn't do the home work, showed up late/intermittantly, etc. The projects were interesting/complex enough to engage the talented kids, but as a teacher it was very unsatisfying and the atmosphere could have been more electric if the others had just dropped away.

That being said, maybe a one on one, heart to heart with the slackers. Ask them what they want to get out of it- you only get back what you put in. See if their goals even fit the band's and ask for a certain level of commitment. I've done that several times with students and it does turn some of them around.

Good Luck! :wave:

[Mike Szarka]

The only solution I know is that those who aren't up to the standard don't get to perform with the band, or even play at practice. Show up with a bagpipe that hasn't been maintained, you don't play. Show up not knowing the new tunes, you don't play. Show up playing like you haven't been practicing, you don't play.

Really, the privilege of performing with the band is all you can give or take away for those who aren't internally motivated to improve.

Mike

[FD Piper]

To get the ball moving, I offer these comments…
In most bands there are many different reasons people join. In a grade 4/5 level band, you probably have many different levels of pipers. Also, the level of participation will change based on the person. A gung-ho individual will be there every week, and be right on with the tune. Another person might be looking at the band as more of a social tool, or stress release of a hectic job or home, and the practicing regularly is not a priority for them.

I also think these people need a reasonable expectation of what is expected of them. Have they been given a set of expectations? If so, have they bought into them?

I would suggest that the leaders first sit down and decide what level they want to perform at. Next look at the resources, and see if you can realistically maintain that goal with the members attending. If not, make the goal match the people, and then try to move the goalpost over the next season or two.

If people are there to fill the goal, then you can develop protocols. Slackers can then decide whether they want to attend, or not. If need be, they may be asked to step to the side until they are ready to meet the needs of the group. I wouldn’t kick them out, but perhaps make a separate group which is the learners. They will decide if they want to learn, or become bored and leave.

FD Piper

[Speeder]

As a college professor I have learned that you can't motivate everyone. I also learned that the better students appreciate a "hard ass" teacher who sets standards and rules and then enforces them.

I teach students who want to become police officers and I'm demanding. My classroom rules say no hats, no food, no lateness and no extraneous conversation. They receive these rules in writing on Day One and I enforce them from the first day of class. I'm led to believe by the grapevine that the kids look forward to my classes because they know what to expect. (We also have a lot of fun :) ).

Way back in the first week of September, one class of first year students was given a written assignment to complete by last week. It was a toughie, required a lot of work and was worth 35% of their final mark. The due date, assignment requirements and a warning that lateness would mean a "zero" mark were given to them in writing the first day of classes.

Every week in class I encouraged, prodded, pushed and cajoled them to start working on it. The day it was due, 14 out of 50 students did not hand it in at the appointed hour. Automatic zero. Three tried to hand it in two days late. They were referred to the written warning about lateness. Long faces but no arguments.

Some of the other faculty are not as strict but when we have faculty meeting, they are the ones who complain about discipline problems, lack of motivation and other classroom problems.

So how does this equate to pipe bands? The good band members will appreciate strict rules. They're there because they want to PLAY and play well. They don't need the slackers dragging them down. If the slackers are allowed to continue, you'll lose the good members.

Set rules, put them in writing, explain them and then enforce them . This isn't being "tyrannical" but it does establish a standard. New members will see that you are a serious group and they will want to be part of it. The first time they see the disciplne slip, your credibilty goes out the window.

Being a beginner in piping, I can relate from the other side as well. Started out with a group of 5 or 6 and now there's just two of us left. The others had no self discipline and soon saw that this was serious business and required commitment. I watch with envy when the band practices around the table. No goofing, just serious practice.

Just my $.02 (CDN) worth.

[Lyle Walker]

I've noticed a lot of the lower level bands have members that don't know pipe maintenance or picked up the basics as they went along. It might be good to take a practice session and go over one of the pipes in disarray putting it right. Not learning the tunes...keep playing them in practice until at least a few people have them down for performances. Nothing like standing around holding your pipes while the rest are playing tunes to motivate.
cheers,
lwalker

[Dave Sanderson]

Just wanted to add a quote here from a book "Attitude is Everything"

Nothing can stop the man
with the right mental attitude
from achieving his goal.
Nothing on earth can help the man
with the wrong attitude.

Thomas Jefferson

In our modern society this does not have to be so gender specific.

Dave

[Jerry R. Pearce]

Hi All:
I'm with Mike on this one. That is the position our P/M has taken. If you don't practice and don't know the music then when you get to a particular engagement you sit and you don't play. And when people come up to you and ask you why you are not on the floor or on the field or the street with the band as they see you in uniform you have to explain why> It happened to me once at a competition and it has never happened since. I wasn't up to standard on the music and believe me I made a vow to myself that would never ever happen again and it hasn't. Mike is right, the only privilege you can take away is the privilege to perform and if you do it at practice in front of their peers your people will or shoud get the message in a hurry. You sit and get your practice chanter. You don't go on the floor at practice. Try it You'll like the results. :hatoff: