Request - Hamilton Beer Tent

[SteveW]

Does anyone happen to have any video of Toronto Police's kick @$$ performance in the beer tent after their kick @$$ win in Hamilton?

[CelticCeith]

What about that Braemar Band ..... they rocked too!!!!

[Tom Foote]

Here is the contest....Toronto Police from the back end.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf15rxkr7wE

[Clothears]

Band sounds good Tom......any footage of the other G1 bands?

[Scott H]

78th Frasers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pO-sRKG4fmk&search=frasers

[SteveW]

Thanks Tom and Scott.
TPPB sounded great...Davie's Wee OJ came out perfectly.
But...78th...whoopie doo...same medley as last year...exciting...good job Livingstone...way to be creative.

[neilly]

It was a draw for medleys ,, so you get the luck of the draw.

[SteveW]

Yes, one of two medleys...but why not come up with 2 new medleys, instead of one the judges have already heard?

[neilly]

:lol:

[Scott Harrison]

Learning one grade 1 medley of that calibre is hard enough when you consider all the concert material the band has or any personal commitments the band members have. When I played with Toronto Police I found it hard enough to learn the new material and I was only in high school, with next to no responsibilities. I couldn't imagine trying to do it now.

I like to hear new stuff just like everyone else, but it isn't always possible. Livingstone is VERY creative with his music, playing the same medley two years running doesn't make him less creative. I think 78th and Toronto sounded equally as good. The competition isn't about what tunes the band plays, it's about how well they play them.

[pokey]

But...78th...whoopie doo...same medley as last year...exciting...good job Livingstone...way to be creative.Well SteveW, when you've amassed the wealth of experience and established the fabulous track record that Bill Livingstone has, then your snide comments like "good job Livingstone" will appear as ridiculous to you then as they do to me now. Somehow I don't think you could carry his pipe box let alone match his accomplishments.

Al Pocock

[Underwood]

what was the name of the intro tune by the Toronto Police.

thanks

[TanoMartone]

Im not into computers all that much but can anyone tell me how to save these videos of both the bands??? Trying to build up an archive!


The tune is called "At long last" we also play it.

[MattB]

But...78th...whoopie doo...same medley as last year...exciting...good job Livingstone...way to be creative.

Did u listen to the difference in tone from last year to this? The sound is now at a much higher level. The tonal qualities added by the midsection are unparallal to last year. And the sides are really starting to tighten up.

Lead that kind of band, and talk. Oh, and do everything Bill has done. Then win a world championship, and have a band that consistently places in the top6 in the world.

Kind of a big step from your gr4 band right now isn't it?

Matt

ps. frasers are my fav band, so i take pretty big offence to them being cut up.

[SteveW]

Change in tone?
OK...did anyone else notice the top hand starting to go midway throught the medley?

You think a musical genius like Bill Livingstone have his top-6 band play something new and original.

[Sydney]

SteveW - you sound as if you have the answers, so why don't you take the 2 hour drive to Toronto, join the band and set Bill Livingstone straight?

[MattB]

SteveW - you sound as if you have the answers, so why don't you take the 2 hour drive to Toronto, join the band and set Bill Livingstone straight?

agreed

[SteveW]

oh no...dont critisize the frasers! thats not allowed! :rolleyes:
Seems to be ubiquitous around here...someone takes a point of view and critisizes an "institution" and they get walked on, but follow the crowd like a mindless sheep and everyone will love you.

I honeslty hope Bill isn't going into a lackadaisical cruise-to-the-finish with his supposed impending retirement. I really look forward to him going out with a bang. Thats the point I'm getting at.

[Sydney]

I am sure the 78th would welcome any constructive criticism given - as long it was from an individual that had the experience and knowledge to be able to offer the criticism in the first place.

[MattB]

It didn't sound like you had much constructive critisism, or even positive insight. You took a stab at a very reputable man, and we are standing up for him, and upholding his reputation. There are tons of people who don't like the frasers, and that's ok. But, i believe you put,

"78th...whoopie doo...same medley as last year...exciting...good job Livingstone...way to be creative. "

That doesn't seem constructive or insightful in any way.

I guess thats what you would call a, "Mindless Sheep?"

[Underwood]

"At long last"

who wrote it, which book is it in...helllllp

Kevin

[John Gaudet]

Originally posted by SteveW:
oh no...dont critisize the frasers! thats not allowed! :rolleyes:
Seems to be ubiquitous around here...someone takes a point of view and critisizes an "institution" and they get walked on, but follow the crowd like a mindless sheep and everyone will love you.

I honeslty hope Bill isn't going into a lackadaisical cruise-to-the-finish with his supposed impending retirement. I really look forward to him going out with a bang. Thats the point I'm getting at. Betting Bill doesn't give a flying fart what you think.

For me its not that you were critical, we are all intitled to our thoughts. It is the ignorance in which you did it. Do you really believe that grade 1 bands every year changed all thier music? Not a chance. And if its good hold onto it for a while.

The beach Boys still play to sold out concerts all over North America , when was the last time they wrote something new? 20 years ago?

[Highland Harry]

Originally posted by John Gaudet:
Do you really believe that grade 1 bands every year changed all thier music? Not a chance. And if its good hold onto it for a while.
IN the 70's & early 80's, bands used to come out with two new medleys every year. Now it's a chore to get them to play one medley.

Must be tough to practice 6 minutes worth of music? :rolleyes:

[tenordrummer.com]

I'm actually glad they're keeping the same medley - it's one of the most entertaining medleys in years. Upside Down in Eden Court... AWESOME!

[Hyper Piper]

SteveW: Your ignorance is the issue, not your critisism. Do some research and see how many grade one bands have played two new medleys in the same year.
Copycat: I'm assuming you've never played with a top grade one band. Until you play "6 minutes" worth of music in the grade one circle a the World's, you just won't get it.

[Hyper Piper]

SteveW: Your ignorance is the issue, not your critisism. Do some research and see how many grade one bands have played two new medleys in the same year.
Copycat: I'm assuming you've never played with a top grade one band. Until you play "6 minutes" worth of music in the grade one circle a the World's, you just won't get it.

[SteveW]

My ignorance? Does it really matter whether 1 G1 band changes their medleys or they all do? It shows far greater musicianship to start fresh every year.

[Hyper Piper]

Quote:

"78th...whoopie doo...same medley as last year...exciting...good job Livingstone...way to be creative."

So you are implying that none of the grade 1 pipe bands are "creative"?

Maybe you should start your own, and show us how a creative one should sound.

[Highland Harry]

Originally posted by Hyper Piper:

Copycat: I'm assuming you've never played with a top grade one band. Until you play "6 minutes" worth of music in the grade one circle a the World's, you just won't get it. Won't get what?

I'm assuming you were never alive in the 70's & 80's to hear fresh new material every year?

Bands like Guelph, City of Toronto, St. Thomas Police, Triumph Street, Scotia Legion were playing really dynamic stuff before it was acceptable at the Worlds in those days.

My first year at the Worlds in gr1 was 1977, what was your first year again?

[Scott Harrison]

SteveW, have you ever played with a grade 1 band? From what I can tell you haven't. Until you learn what it is like to learn all the material for a band like 78th I suggest that you hold your tongue.

Musicianship is not measured in how much music you can memorize. It's measured in how well you play the tunes you already know.

[Highland Harry]

Originally posted by Scott Harrison:

Musicianship is not measured in how much music you can memorize. It's measured in how well you play the tunes you already know. It's apparent that many gr1 bands don't know 3 tunes well enough to get thru the qualifier.

[MattB]

Ok, this is starting to turn into a nattering fest.

SteveW I really suggest you just stop, because you are just embarassing yourself. First you take a stab at one of the best pipers of the time. Now you are saying that they are not great musicians.

Just stop, I really hope this post gets closed soon so SteveW can stop proving to us how little he knows.

"The older I grow, the More I Recall,
The Little I knew, When I knew it All"

[Highland Harry]

Originally posted by MattB:
Just stop, I really hope this post gets closed soon so SteveW can stop proving to us how little he knows.Regardless of his experience, is he not allowed to express his views?

[MattB]

A point of view yes. But critisizing one of the best pipers of our time, seems a little over the top.

[A Bruce]

MattB: You are hardly more experienced than Steve W and yet you are stating your opinion as though it is fact and as though you actually know better than him. In your latest post you have stated YOUR opinion of Bill Livingstone as though it is a generally accepted fact. I'm pretty sure that not every piper in the world considers B. Livingstone "one of the best pipers of our time". He is very accomplished both in the solo world and in the band world and IS someone to be admired.....however, he is NOT the only Pipe Major who deserves that respect. It is possible to respect someone as an accomplished person and still dislike their style of doing things. For example, I find Donald Trump to be arrogant...but he is INCREDIBLY accomplished. The great thing about the pipe band world is that there ARE differing styles out there. Competitions would be incredibly boring to listen to if all bands played in the same way.

Hyperpiper and Scott Harrison: When it comes to bands learning new music each year.....is it not more impressive to learn brand new music AND play them amazingly than to simply play your old music amazingly???? There are and have been many bands that do accomplish this each year. Two of this year's Ontario Grade 1 bands have learned two new medleys this year and have been doing well in competition. It is also possible to make your music do double duty. Use parts of medleys and sets in a rearranged way as concert repertoire. Or use former competition music in your concert repertoire instead of learning extra pieces. What we have said is true of many types of musical groups. Symphonic orchestras learn an incredible amount of new music each year. Yes, they keep a certain amount of their repertoire from year to year. However, both amateur and professional groups also learn hundreds of HOURS of new music each year and play at amazing levels. Pipe bands would only be learning approximately 30 minutes of new music each year. Not so much when you look at the big picture of the MUSIC world.

Andrew (Toronto Police Pipe Band) and Ruth (Ottawa Police Pipes and Drums)

[Sydney]

Just learned an interesting fact that all of you Toronto Police Pipe Band members and supporters (aka 78th and Bill Livingstone bashers) might want to factor in here ... it seems the P/M and P/Sgt of the cops take lessons directly from Mr Livingstone. I guess the leaders in the band don't share your views :blush: )

[SteveW]

What's your source for this information Sydney?

[Sydney]

James MacHattie and Sean McKeown

[SteveW]

Why would the PM and PS take tuition from the PM of a rival band? I know for a fact that James MacHattie's methods are derived from Terry and Jack Lee, from when James played with SFU.

[Sticky Fingers]

I think a lot of comments are getting out of hand and by no means do I think Andrew was taking a stab at the Frasers. Everybody go to their respective corners and try to enter the discussion with a cool head. I think the thread opened with some pretty bold statements but that does not mean it should be continued on with others trying to match that.

Yes, everybody has their opinion and yes, everybody has a right to share their opinion no matter how valid. I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that Toronto Police hates the Frasers or Bill Livingstone himself. It's also a bit far to question the credibility of either group.

Cheers,
Justin Howland

[Sydney]

I don't think that the Toronto Police hate the Frasers or Bill Livingstone. I saw both bands at Hamilton and in Kincardine. When Toronto won, the 78th were all over to congratulate them and vice versa in Kincardine. From my perspective it looks like there is a lot of mutual respect and admiration betwen the two groups.

I just think that there are some people on this forum who speak out of turn and make comments that are not only insulting to Bill and the 78th, but to the Toronoto Police Pipe Band themselves.

And SteveW, once again you show us that you don't know what you are talking about. James and Sean are quite open and complintary about Bill's teaching and if you knew them at all - you would know this.

[Bayoupiper]

Did we ever find out if there is a video of Toronto Police's beer tent performance at Hamilton?
Been waiting to see that..........


BP

[Jazz]

Sydney, You are right that both James and Sean have had instruction from Bill Livingstone. Also in the Toronto Pipe corps is Andrew Hayes who took (takes?) lessons from Livingstone. Another interesting note is that Doug Stronach (lead drummer) helped Bill with his Piobaireachd Diaries CDs.

What you have gotten wrong is that there is some sort of animosity between Toronto Police Band Members/supporters and the 78th's members or supporters. From what I saw at Hamilton, both bands seem to get along fine and seem to be happy that Grade 1 in Ontario is competitive. Why wouldn't the bands be happy about this? It only serves to prepare them better for Scotland.

[Eric M]

Originally posted by A Bruce:
[...]However, both amateur and professional groups also learn hundreds of HOURS of new music each year and play at amazing levels. [/QB]I don't believe that statement... it would take 5 straight weeks to get through just 200 hours of music if you played 8 hours every day, 5 days a week. So you would only play any given section no more than 10x, including performances. And then you would move on to a whole new repertoire.

Eric

[txasbass]

I just think this is really funny. The best part about this is yall are defending and bashing bands and players that could care less about what you have to say.

[tenorrhythmia]

Eric M:

Perhaps Andrew and I were not clear enough in our earlier posting. I was referring to professional orchestras and muscial groups. Their only job is to learn music and many of the musicians play more than 8 hours a day. Especially when you consider all of the solo work and teaching repertoire that many of them have.

Sorry if I was confusing and made it sound like I was talking about pipe bands.

Ruth

[Eric M]

Ruth,

The posts were clear enough. I understood that you weren't talking about pipe bands. I just don't believe that anyone learns hundreds of hours of new music each and every year.

Eric

[Eric M]

So.... did anyone record Toronto Police in the beer tent at Hamilton?

Eric

[Stig Bang-Mortensen]

Originally posted by CopyCat:
[/QUOTE]IN the 70's & early 80's, bands used to come out with two new medleys every year. Now it's a chore to get them to play one medley.

Must be tough to practice 6 minutes worth of music? :rolleyes: [/QB][/QUOTE]

The difference between the medleys then and now is that then they made two medleys up of what ever sounded well together from Scots Guards and MacLeods collections (Well not exactely but you get the idea). Todays medleys take an awfull lot of work knitting the various parts together.

Bands then played march/strathspey/reel/hornpipe/jig more or less straight forward maybe with a slow air somewhere with basic seconds.

The Canadian pipebands has a lot to answer for here as regards to development of the medleys :wink:

[Lady Guinevere705]

I am not a regular poster here but I do enjoy the amount of great advice given by those who do. Having said that, I find that I must reply here and agree with Ruth....apologies to Eric M. My husband has trained as a pianist for solo and orchestra....8-10 hours a day practice is just "upkeep". So learning hundreds of hours a year is not unusual.....it's the norm.

[New Hudson Highlander]

Yeah, anyone find that video?


-NHH