Welcome to
the forums at bobdunsire.com
bobdunsire.com forums One of the largest message boards on the web ! bobdunsire.com forums
You can reset your password by going here. Be sure to try your current email and any email addresses you may have had in the past.
Otherwise please use the Contact Us link at the bottom of the forums. In order to help you, please provide the following info: Your Display Name from the old forum and any possible email addresses you would have used before. Without that info we cannot locate your account.


Go Back   Bob Dunsire Bagpipe Forums > General Discussion > Beer Tent
Register FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Beer Tent The general discussion forum, and the place to start a new "beer-tent-like" Piping Related discussion...

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-29-2020, 04:45 AM   #21
Mac an t-Sealgair
Forum Gold Medal
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Eilean Siar
Posts: 502
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

I just don't get it. Does it matter, in the grand scheme of things what your jointing material is??

And, if bagpipe hemp is so bad why is it still supplied by all the great and the good of bagpipe makers, either as material or installed as standard from the factory?

Reminds me of my motorbike racing days, there were the heroes in the pits that bought a good bike then spent all their time taking off all the standard stuff and bolting on aftermarket goodies. ALOT of money spent, and yes, a pretty bike at the end of it.
However when it came to racing, those guys were at the back of the pack. Waaaaaaay at the back.
When they came in they'd complain 'this isn't working' or 'need to tweak this', they never looked at themselves.
The folk that were on top were the guys that practiced regularly, maintained there bikes as standard, and put in the laps. They knew there was more time in themselves than in the bike. Bagpiping is exactly the same.

As I was once told by an old fellow at a race in Tain, ' it's not the bike you ride, but how you ride the bike!'.

Interesting distraction maybe but not one I'll be partaking in, I'll be practicing.
Mac an t-Sealgair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 09:05 AM   #22
Matt Willis Bagpiper
Forum Gold Medal
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Carrollton, TX
Posts: 601
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac an t-Sealgair View Post
I just don't get it. Does it matter, in the grand scheme of things what your jointing material is??

And, if bagpipe hemp is so bad why is it still supplied by all the great and the good of bagpipe makers, either as material or installed as standard from the factory?
Appealing to tradition is one of the oldest logical fallacies, but I feel is largely at play both here. The "it's always been done that way" is no reason to continue doing it that way if alternative methods are demonstrably better.

I have spent a lot of time and effort comparing various strings and made a video of my conclusion: https://youtu.be/Nk084bazXT0. In short, I will continue to use polyester thread on all my instruments, even after testing multiple other stings.

As for "does it matter?" Well, if ones "hemp" (real or linen, waxed or unwaxed) swells, they may well get a cracked bagpipe part, or not be able to readily remove a section of your instrument. Polyester thread does not have that problem, as I have shown in more than a few videos.
__________________
Matt Willis Bagpiper
YouTube Channel Winner of the 2020 The Big Rab Show Awards for Best Social Media!
Personal Website

Last edited by Matt Willis Bagpiper; 10-29-2020 at 09:07 AM.
Matt Willis Bagpiper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 10:55 AM   #23
John McCain
Holy smoking keyboard!
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Portland, Maine
Posts: 3,323
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Well-packed (as in rolled on a hard surface when installing), waxed hemp will last a decade or more on a daily-played instrument. That's even playing a variety of weather conditions and for long periods.

But, here's the "trick". Disassemble the pipes and swab after playing and leave them completely dissembled until you play them next. Store the set in a case with humidity control. This takes the pressure off the wood and the hemp as well as insuring the wood and the hemp are not over-humidified or dried out.

I realize this is what most pipers do not want to do.
__________________
"What we play is life." - Louis Armstrong
John McCain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 12:06 PM   #24
Lochie
Forum Regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 201
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

I operate and maintain 3 sets of pipes. I also frequently obtain used sets, give them a minor refurb, and pass them on to newer players.
I hate hemping....
Anything that will last longer will be a bonus for me.
We discovered a really heavy duty upholstery thread that's designed for sewing buttons on pillows for outdoor patio furniture.
Many of us use it ONLY on our blowpipes. It's coarse and kind of ugly looking, but it's bullet proof....no more stinky rotting hemp replacement every year....
Lochie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 04:53 PM   #25
Pip01
Holy smoking keyboard!
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: North America
Posts: 3,775
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?





Greetings to All,

And... no... I haven't as yet... gotten the polyester
thread shown in the advert... Ain't been enough Time. :)

But I do wish to pose the question... about the subject
that I raised above.

Any here... feel... think... observe... that the yellow hemp
available to us today... and seemingly quite irrespective...
of from whom... or what House... or Shop it may come...
is rather inferior... and in both thickness.. and quality... to
what has been... was... previously available to us??

Now... and to be sure... I am not ascribing any fault... or
flim-flam... to any... of our purveyors!!... because they...
do not make... the hemp!! They simply send to us what
the manufacturers make... and send to them.

And in our present world... alas... candy bars have gotten
smaller... though the prices have increased... and I guess
we're just damned lucky... that a pint... is still... a pint !! :)

All observations... and thoughts... gratefully accepted... :)

Regards to All,

Pip01






__________________
My friends all know,
With what a brave carouse...
Pip01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 09:09 PM   #26
William McKenzie
Holy smoking keyboard!
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1,071
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pancelticpiper View Post
Pardon my skepticism, but I've been piping 45 years and I've seen numerous joint-hemping fads come and go.

There was the thing where pipers were taking their pipes into normal music shops and having the joints corked, like clarinets.
My original instructor had corked hemps on vintage Hendersons that he had had put on years prior. He loved it and didn't know why hemp was still a thing if I recall. It did require grease occasionally but not different than anything else really.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pancelticpiper View Post
There was the thing about putting teflon tape on all the joints.

Then there was the O-ring thing.
The Teflon and O-rings are tough to me in very different ways. I've found O-rings on pipes can swell or shrink with heat and there's no reasonable way to get the correct fit. Teflon shreds and tears after a while. I do use it here and there but the polyester thread has a similar effect you can get the proper fit from the get go.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pip01 View Post
I shall report upon this... my new experience... somewhere
down The Pike... and... "As the Old Chariot Rolls Along"...
when this "new"... at least to me... material... is in hand...
You pick some up then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lochie View Post
Anything that will last longer will be a bonus for me.
We discovered a really heavy duty upholstery thread that's designed for sewing buttons on pillows for outdoor patio furniture.
Upholstery thread was one of the ones I tried actually before settling on the above. I still have that roll and it's also made by Coats and Clark. Strong stuff and still thin like hemp. It's beige and although that's not a big deal to me it's thinness still took too many winds and its strength really dug into my fingers. Very strong though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Willis Bagpiper View Post
Appealing to tradition is one of the oldest logical fallacies, but I feel is largely at play both here. The "it's always been done that way" is no reason to continue doing it that way if alternative methods are demonstrably better.

I have spent a lot of time and effort comparing various strings and made a video of my conclusion: https://youtu.be/Nk084bazXT0. In short, I will continue to use polyester thread on all my instruments, even after testing multiple other stings.

As for "does it matter?" Well, if ones "hemp" (real or linen, waxed or unwaxed) swells, they may well get a cracked bagpipe part, or not be able to readily remove a section of your instrument. Polyester thread does not have that problem, as I have shown in more than a few videos.
Well said.

I don't intend this offensively but I think there's this aversion on our forum to anything different from "how it's been done" or that its automatically a bother to learn something new instead of being curious and open minded.

Again, I don't mean this condescendingly. I understand there's always some "revolutionary" product that comes out over the years that people get into and then abandon them to go back to what is "tried and true". But as Matt said, if something is demonstrably better and saves time and headache, why resist that?
__________________
Happy Piping
William McKenzie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2020, 07:48 AM   #27
Klondike Waldo
Holy smoking keyboard!
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Braintree MA USA
Posts: 8,621
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by William McKenzie View Post
My original instructor had corked hemps on vintage Hendersons that he had had put on years prior. He loved it and didn't know why hemp was still a thing if I recall. It did require grease occasionally but not different than anything else really.

SNIP
I was a school band director when I started piping, so maintained school instruments for years, including pads and cork on the woodwinds, I used cork on my hamp joints for many years.The cork, though would tend to compact with use and need to be re-sized by putting on some cork grease and heating over a candle, causing thencork to absorb the grease and swell back up to size. No big deal, but after a number of such adjustments, the r grease would work its way through the cork to the glue holding the cork to the ABW and the cork would come away from the joint. Polyester requires less maintenance, it seems, than either cork or hemp/linen/cotton/ what have you.
__________________
Slainte Leibh/ Slan Leat, Bob Cameron
Klondike Waldo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2020, 04:59 AM   #28
Mac an t-Sealgair
Forum Gold Medal
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Eilean Siar
Posts: 502
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by William McKenzie View Post

Again, I don't mean this condescendingly. I understand there's always some "revolutionary" product that comes out over the years that people get into and then abandon them to go back to what is "tried and true". But as Matt said, if something is demonstrably better and saves time and headache, why resist that?
I understand, and I suppose the same has been said for the other methods already mentioned. Time will tell. I've never had a problem with 'traditional' (whatever that means) hemp.

Be interesting to know how many of the piping elite i.e. gold medalists and current masters of piping are currently using this thread, or are converting right now?

My point is, that there is a lot of agonising over something that IMO will give you a 0% performance benefit. Diverting focus and time away from something that will actually improve playing/steadiness etc.
Mac an t-Sealgair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2020, 06:52 AM   #29
el gaitero
Holy smoking keyboard!
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Estados Unidos
Posts: 7,052
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac an t-Sealgair View Post


....a lot of agonising over something that IMO will give you a 0% performance benefit. Diverting focus and time away from something that will actually improve playing/steadiness etc.
Certainly seems much ado......

but,fwiw,...I did ‘re-hemp’ my blowsticks using that thin flat ‘nylon’ black twine about 4 years ago...when a friendly Forumite kindly sent me some of the whole bale he bought for cheap....enough to re-do a Regiment;
.....haven’t had to touch it since then though absolutely dripping on many occasions.
el gaitero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-31-2020, 10:01 AM   #30
Matt Willis Bagpiper
Forum Gold Medal
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Carrollton, TX
Posts: 601
Default Re: Polyester thread replacing hemp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac an t-Sealgair View Post
My point is, that there is a lot of agonising over something that IMO will give you a 0% performance benefit. Diverting focus and time away from something that will actually improve playing/steadiness etc.
I've played in wet enough conditions that "traditional" hemp had caused the tuning joints to swell enough to cause issues on the day. Yeah, I just took a bit of the hemp off and was able to readily tune again, but.. That was an actual hinderance caused by the hemp itself, and it took time on an already busy and stressful day when I had other things to be concerned about. So I guess my journey started then.

With the polyester thread, the joints have not had that problem under the same conditions.

Also, we can't be practicing all the time. Sometimes it's 11pm and I have some spare time and have already put in a few hours of playing that day. No harm in spending some of that time maintaining my instrument, be it checking bag airtightness, cleaning the valve and blowpipe, or restringing a joint or two with a non-swelling material...
__________________
Matt Willis Bagpiper
YouTube Channel Winner of the 2020 The Big Rab Show Awards for Best Social Media!
Personal Website
Matt Willis Bagpiper is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:48 AM.