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History, Tradition, Heritage As related to the subjects of piping, drumming and pipe bands.

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Old 09-13-2010, 07:47 AM   #31
magsevenband
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

Many of the County bands in those days were based in the Bronx and Queens, as so many of the Irish who were civil servants in the Police, Fire and Transit agencies resided there. It was a hotbed for music in general, with Pipe bands being one element of the culture.
As the Scots were mostly based across the Hudson in Kearny, NJ instruction could be had by either traveling there or bringing over the instructors to the city itself. Murdoch Buchanan is one name that comes to mind, others may be able to provide additional info.
Once the basics were learned, the music could be adapted to fit the general aims of the group.
Robert Hogan of the NYPD Emeralds wrote an excellent book a few years back which delves more completely into the subject, particularly as it pertained their band. It was a fascinating read at the time, not sure where my copy is though.
If I recall, there were several other County bands that existed and not mentioned heretofore, Tipperary being one.
I know that the Kerry Pipers were founded in the 70's by the Moore brothers, excellent pipers in their own right. I remember seeing their first recruiting ad in the Irish Echo circa 1974 if memory serves.

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Old 09-13-2010, 08:21 AM   #32
Michael Faughnan
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

Thanks Al..

Who was Murdoch Buchanan and where was he from? I have heard his name and actually have met quite a few people whom suggest they now play his pipes. Was there more than one Buchanan in the area ? What band did he play with? The only refereance I see on the net had Murdoch playing once to demonstate teh Pipes on the Capatin Kangaroo TV show.
http://www.tv.com/captain-kangaroo/j...487/recap.html

Michael

Last edited by Michael Faughnan; 09-13-2010 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 09-13-2010, 10:44 AM   #33
Michael Faughnan
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

Adam,

In doing a final search for your Neil Duddy on the Social Security Death Index I saw a Neil Duddy that was born July 4, 1905 Died May 1975 at 69 yrs of age. His SS# was issued in New York and his last addess of record was San Diego California. I'm not 100% that this is him but looks pretty good that it is. I am wondering if anyone knows if he got into any Piping circles in San Diego.

Michael

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Old 09-13-2010, 11:39 AM   #34
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Faughnan View Post
Adam,

In doing a final search for your Neil Duddy on the Social Security Death Index I saw a Neil Duddy that was born July 4, 1905 Died May 1975 at 69 yrs of age. His SS# was issued in New York and his last addess of record was San Diego California. I'm not 100% that this is him but looks pretty good that it is. I am wondering if anyone knows if he got into any Piping circles in San Diego.

Michael
Duddy was born and raised in Clydebank, Glasgow, 4th July 1905, but emigrated to the US, New York in 1930 at the age of 25, so the birth date would be right. Being born on the 4th July, it's no wonder he ended up in the US.
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Last edited by Adam Sanderson; 09-13-2010 at 12:21 PM. Reason: Clarifying date.
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Old 09-13-2010, 02:15 PM   #35
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

County Cork: I always heard 1928. My first uniform jacket was from the 1930's that I remember! (kilt: Cameron of Erracht) I should know more about this band... I remember meeting the elderly man in Rockaway in 1976 who had been the PM in the 1940's to 1950's but his name escapes me. He had daughters who played in the band...

Want to open up a new can of worms.... how many of those county bands would not allow girls to play-- LOL
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Old 09-14-2010, 05:48 AM   #36
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

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Originally Posted by magsevenband View Post
the repertoires were full of tunes that were not Pipe tunes at all, but rather, adaptations of songs by the Clancy Brothers and The Wolfe Tones. Mind you, not many of these tunes fit the scale of the Pipes and had rather awkward and ill fitting arrangements.
I find this very interesting!

I've played uilleann pipes and Irish flute and whistle in Irish "folk" bands for many years and have played many of these sorts of songs, and the idea of creating a Highland pipe repertoire out of them is fascinating.

An interesting thing is that there are a number of Irish folk songs which fit on the scale of the GHB perfectly, in fact better than they do on the scale of the uilleann pipes, if you can believe it. I play these every year on St Patrick's Day.

I would have little difficulty, if I spent an hour or two, coming up with a twenty or thirty tune repertoire for an Irish pipe band, of Irish folksongs and dance music which fit the GHB scale very well.

About the Tirconnell/Donegal thing, I think it's another facet of the way in which the modern Irish counties don't quite correspond to the traditional regions.
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Old 09-18-2010, 09:40 AM   #37
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Quote:
I remember meeting the elderly man in Rockaway in 1976 who had been the PM in the 1940's to 1950's but his name escapes me. He had daughters who played in the band...
I met someone Thursday night who knew his name-- Dan Lynch.
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Old 09-19-2010, 06:56 PM   #38
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

I think this subject has been covered quite well in the above threads, but I did want to offer some personal insight into the feelings of that time. If you look at the list of Irish County pipe bands that someone offered above, you will note that most of them are from the County Associations from the Ulster counties (e.g. Tyrone, Donegal, Fermanagh, Armagh, and, I believe, Monaghan).

The memberships of these County Associations at that time were primarily and strongly Nationalist. British control of the six Northern Ireland counties was seen by many as a raw wound. In the pipe bands of at least some of the Associations, the equipment and uniforms were provided by the Association, thus giving the leadership theoretical control of band activities. Normally, this did not affect the day-to-day operation of the bands. They played in both Scottish and Irish competitions, patriotic parades and what have you. One significant exception was sensitivity about activities which were considered "British". According to my information, the president of the County Donegal Association at the time the QEII first docked in New York was an individual with a "heightened" sense of "No British" activities. He apparently made the decision that the QEII represented the British Government, and that the Donegal Pipe Band could not honor their commitment to play for the ship's arrival. When the band's members ignored his order not to play, he apparently became apoplectic at this challenge to his authority, disbanded the band and destroyed the uniforms and perhaps the drums. (The pipes were usually the property of the individual pipers, but some sets may have belonged to the Association, and could have been included in the destruction.) At the time, I remember no criticism of the Association president's actions in the Irish newspapers in the New York area, although individual pipers were appalled.

As has been said above, one has to understand the depth of feeling that existed at that time. Many of the members of the Ulster county Associations had been directly affected by events in Northern Ireland. In some cases, those events were the reasons these folks came to the US in the first place. Openmindedness was not a valued quality. Hopefully, this is no longer the situation, although with the recent "Troubles", I'm sure there are still some members of those groups who have a visceral reaction to the Crown or the Union Jack. Hopefully, they are not pipers. Adam Sanderson's comments about the QEII being the vessel of a private company with no government connections would not have calmed the feelings of folks who were operating on a highly charged emotional level.
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Old 09-20-2010, 01:33 AM   #39
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

A well written contribution
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Old 09-26-2010, 11:26 PM   #40
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Default Re: Donegal Pipers, New York City

http://books.google.com/books?id=w9s...20band&f=false


Page 166-167 mentions the pipe band playing on the tug boat and that they were wearing green kilts.
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