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Beer Tent The general discussion forum, and the place to start a new "beer-tent-like" Piping Related discussion...

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Old 01-14-2019, 06:39 AM   #1
Jim Fogelman
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Default Sharpness War

I know the subject of ever increasing chanter pitch comes up from time to time, and this video showed up on my YouTube suggestions.

It's not about piping/pipe band tuning, but it is about how pitch was increasing in the classical orchestral world and thought people here might find it interesting to see that we pipers/the pipe band world are not alone in pitch creep.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzznBt8tVnI
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Old 01-14-2019, 08:18 AM   #2
Leong
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Just more evidence that we are all going to the dogs....
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Old 01-14-2019, 08:18 AM   #3
Pip01
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Default Re: Sharpness War





Jim!!,

Thank you!! Marvelous vid!!

Wonderful art!! Wonderful education!!

A "Must See"... for all..... :)

Again, many thanks!!, and...Regards,

Pip01







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Old 01-15-2019, 06:41 AM   #4
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Default Re: Sharpness War

But the 19th century British pitch was not A=439 but A=452, called Old Philharmonic Pitch.

It's why old flutes saxes etc play so sharp, unless marked "LP" (low pitch) which is A=440.

Our modern B flat=480 is very close to A=452, meaning that in the 1990s Pipe Bands finally rose to the pitch that English orchestras were playing at a century earlier.

But yes clarinets are commonly offered today at A=440 and A=442 due to so many orchestras playing higher than 440.
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Old 01-21-2019, 12:49 PM   #5
bob864
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Default Re: Sharpness War

I think our pitch creep is more about the drones than the chanters.
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Old 01-21-2019, 01:02 PM   #6
el gaitero
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Quote:
Originally Posted by bob864 View Post
I think our pitch creep is more about the drones than the chanters.
...and drum heads....leading to the chicken- egg discussion....
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Old 01-21-2019, 05:52 PM   #7
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Quote:
Originally Posted by el gaitero View Post
...and drum heads....leading to the chicken- egg discussion....
Precisely...I despise modern drum heads and their right din.
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Old 01-22-2019, 05:03 AM   #8
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Quote:
Originally Posted by magsevenband View Post
Precisely...I despise modern drum heads and their right din.

First rule of Pipe Band : if in doubt, blame the drummers
Second rule of Pipe Band : if in doubt, blame the drummers.




Solo piper's pitch is creeping up too. Discuss



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Old 01-22-2019, 05:38 AM   #9
Klondike Waldo
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Quote:
Originally Posted by gisahag View Post
First rule of Pipe Band : if in doubt, blame the drummers
Second rule of Pipe Band : if in doubt, blame the drummers.




Solo piper's pitch is creeping up too. Discuss



Neil
How many solo pipers are not also in a band? If the judges are hearing pipes at 480Hz+ all day, how would a set at 466-472 Hz sound to them?

FWIW, I don't have a dog in this fight- I play older pipes set up for 466 HZ because when I'm not playing solo, I'm playing with other instruments that are concert pitch.
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Old 01-22-2019, 07:27 AM   #10
pancelticpiper
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Default Re: Sharpness War

Quote:
Originally Posted by bob864 View Post
I think our pitch creep is more about the drones than the chanters.

That's an interesting twist!

Especially because so many players are playing old drones which were designed to play around A=450 to A=460, or modern copies of those drones.

I was playing in bands when the huge pitch leap from 466 to the mid-470s occurred (from the late 1970s through the 1980s) and most serious pipers were playing drones from the 1890-1930 period. The trick was to find small enough tenor reeds to overdrive the drones up to the higher pitch. (We're talking cane reeds then.)


A fictitious parallel situation would be if top clarinet players were all playing old clarinets designed to play a quarter-tone lower than today's standard, and mouthpiece and reed makers were constantly experimenting with ways to force those old flat clarinets to play up to modern pitch. I was talking to a professional clarinetist about it and he said that such a thing would be inconceivable in the clarinet world.
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